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Toptube
Anti-cabbage Party Candidate
Joined: 23 Apr 2007
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 Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:34 pm |
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| Mirror's Edge has more in common with Sands of Time than it does with Portal. |
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:59 pm |
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Except Mirror's Edge is simple and elegant in its execution, and SoT is definitely a console game.
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SuperWes
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 7:29 pm |
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Except Sands of Time actually allows you to make most of the jumps you're attempting to make even if you're slightly off. If Mirror's Edge had learned from Sands of Time we might have something.
EDIT:
| Quote: |
| Except Mirror's Edge is simple and elegant in its execution, and SoT is definitely a console game. |
I really like this quote. Simplicity and elegance of execution is basically the defining feature of console gaming.
-Wes
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 7:49 pm |
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It sounds like you're just no good at the game.
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Toptube
Anti-cabbage Party Candidate
Joined: 23 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:47 pm |
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| SuperWes wrote: |
| Except Sands of Time actually allows you to make most of the jumps you're attempting to make even if you're slightly off. If Mirror's Edge had learned from Sands of Time we might have something. |
I think that's stupid. It removes the challenge from major segments of the game. That's my only gripe with Uncharted. It is fun to climb around, but its not at all difficult because the game gives you a lot of wiggle room. |
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kzkb1
Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Location: a city where you don't come to find love, you come to find the truth
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:08 pm |
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| Sands of Time is aesthetically interesting; Mirror's Edge isn't. |
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Cossix
submersible administrator
Joined: 21 Dec 2006
Location: San Jose
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:13 pm |
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| kzkb1 wrote: |
| Sands of Time is aesthetically interesting; Mirror's Edge isn't. |
Wow, what? Mirror's Edge is fucking gorgeous. |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:53 pm |
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is mirror's edge written by jordan mechner I DON'T THINK SO
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Mikey
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Location: endless backlog
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 11:58 pm |
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| another god wrote: |
| Mikey wrote: |
| firenze wrote: |
clunky jumping mechanics
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The jumping mechanics are fine, it's the level design that gets in the way at times. |
The level design isn't bad. It's just not something you're used to seeing. Wait a couple weeks and you'll see youtube videos speed running the game in simple, understandable ways. |
Well to be sure I've definitely seen a marked improvement in my own ability to go from A to B lickity split, but you've got to admit that at first it's hard as hell to figure out where to go - the game even capitulates and gives you a button which will face you in the right direction if you get lost. I should add that this didn't bother me - I just see why it is turning other people off. |
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glossolalia
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 1:19 am |
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| another god wrote: |
| It sounds like you're just no good at the game. |
it does.
maybe, just maybe, the game requires good timing because so does real parkour? because so does every good platformer? if the game gave much more leeway, people would complain it was a qte-fest. they hit the perfect balance, in my opinion. |
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google
Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 1:36 am |
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I fucking hate this game.
This bitch gave me the best head I've ever had, and now suddenly she cant remember what the fuck she's supposed to be doing.
I'm never seeing her again.
I'm going back to sports games!
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kzkb1
Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Location: a city where you don't come to find love, you come to find the truth
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 1:41 am |
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| Cossix wrote: |
| kzkb1 wrote: |
| Sands of Time is aesthetically interesting; Mirror's Edge isn't. |
Wow, what? Mirror's Edge is fucking gorgeous. |
Don't agree. |
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google
Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 1:46 am |
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| kzkb1 wrote: |
| Cossix wrote: |
| kzkb1 wrote: |
| Sands of Time is aesthetically interesting; Mirror's Edge isn't. |
Wow, what? Mirror's Edge is fucking gorgeous. |
Don't agree. |
I agree with you.
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 2:33 am |
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| glossolalia wrote: |
| another god wrote: |
| It sounds like you're just no good at the game. |
it does.
maybe, just maybe, the game requires good timing because so does real parkour? because so does every good platformer? if the game gave much more leeway, people would complain it was a qte-fest. they hit the perfect balance, in my opinion. |
Yeah guys remember Assassin's Creed? HOLD UP TO CLIMB ANYTHING, that was compelling.
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Mr Mustache
Mean Mr. Mustache
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: Bushwick
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:12 am |
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Guys, this game gives me the same sort of unpleasant feeling that I get from the newer Prince of Persias. I think there is definitely something interesting here, probably more interesting than Sands of Time or whatever, but it doesn't really come together.
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glossolalia
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:25 am |
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is the unpleasant feeling that of your dinner rising into your throat? because i get that after about twenty minutes. it sucks.
the only complaint i have with the in-game art design is that they overdo the contrast in certain areas, otherwise it is the perfect videogame city that is fact if you disagree i am very sorry that you are wrong. it's probably going to date really well. best primary colors ever. |
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Toups
tyranically banal
Joined: 03 Dec 2006
Location: Ebon Keep
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:09 am |
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I'd like this game a lot better if it didn't have a story.
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glossolalia
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:25 am |
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| i'm doing my best to pretend it doesn't. |
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:53 am |
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I bet anyone that if they try to EXCEL at this game that they will LOVE it. The only people I know that *don't* like this game are the people that want the game to *give them satisfaction*. Everyone else, everyone who thinks they have to *earn* the love, loves this game more than any game they've played in years.
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Mikey
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Location: endless backlog
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:50 am |
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| AG what is your favorite level? I'm pretty sure mine is Flight but I like the interior portions of The Shard very much. |
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Lurky
banned
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 2:08 pm |
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| Herr Toups wrote: |
| I'd like this game a lot better if it didn't have a story. |
Turn the Dialogue bar in sound options all the way down.
Press select often.
It doesn't have a story, it has loading. |
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 3:06 pm |
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I played through it the first time with a friend, so I haven't played everything personally. After playing Time Trials, I've figured out what parts of the game interest me personally, and I'm going back to the story mode to play through it again.
I really like the first stage because it's easy to do, and a lot of the chase scenes are fun (if only for the illusion of running with someone else). I'll probably have more of an opinion after my second playthrough.
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Mikey
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Location: endless backlog
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idle
QUAD DAMAGE!!!
Joined: 10 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:28 pm |
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| SuperWes wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Except Mirror's Edge is simple and elegant in its execution, and SoT is definitely a console game. |
I really like this quote. Simplicity and elegance of execution is basically the defining feature of console gaming.
-Wes |
lolwut
If simplicity and elegance were ever the defining feature of console games they ceased being so years ago, around the dawn of the last console gen at the latest. Focus-tested, corporate approved game design absolutely slathered in menus, in-game systems, achievements/trophies, unlockables, DLC, and so on is the defining feature of console games nowadays.
I still haven't played Mirror's Edge, to get back to the subject at hand. I vowed to boycott it after EA announced, several months after they first revealed it and mere weeks before it was released, that they planned on making a (presumably EPIC) trilogy out of the game. It struck me as disgustingly cynical and EA-ish. Anyway, mission successful, I suppose. |
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:42 pm |
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| idle wrote: |
| SuperWes wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Except Mirror's Edge is simple and elegant in its execution, and SoT is definitely a console game. |
I really like this quote. Simplicity and elegance of execution is basically the defining feature of console gaming.
-Wes |
lolwut
If simplicity and elegance were ever the defining feature of console games they ceased being so years ago, around the dawn of the last console gen at the latest. Focus-tested, corporate approved game design absolutely slathered in menus, in-game systems, achievements/trophies, unlockables, DLC, and so on is the defining feature of console games nowadays. |
But by that measure, Sands of Time isn't "a console game" either, as it features precisely none of that cruft at all. It's entirely linear and contains no extra content of any kind.
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SuperWes
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:50 pm |
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| idle wrote: |
lolwut
If simplicity and elegance were ever the defining feature of console games they ceased being so years ago, around the dawn of the last console gen at the latest. Focus-tested, corporate approved game design absolutely slathered in menus, in-game systems, achievements/trophies, unlockables, DLC, and so on is the defining feature of console games nowadays.
I still haven't played Mirror's Edge, to get back to the subject at hand. I vowed to boycott it after EA announced, several months after they first revealed it and mere weeks before it was released, that they planned on making a (presumably EPIC) trilogy out of the game. It struck me as disgustingly cynical and EA-ish. Anyway, mission successful, I suppose. |
Nothing in this post makes any sense to me. The most popular PC game right now by a large margin is this:
Which is the epitome of Focus-tested, corporate approved game design absolutely slathered in menus, in-game systems, achievements/trophies, unlockables, and DLC, but somehow you think that console games are inelegant messes? Try again.
Also: your opinion is invalidated when you boycott a game based on the announcement that it will have sequels.
-Wes
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:59 pm |
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I think it's funny that Wes is being corrected on something he said that was wrong (SoT being simple and elegant) in a really horrible shitty way.
Arcade games are simple, Console games are sort of complicated, and PC games are just... well they're PC games. ME feels a lot like an arcade game to me - it has very simple controls. The rest of it is based on timing. And even though the game is confusing to some people, the amount of things you can possible intuit and the amount of things you can do is pretty close. The speed and everything else is about timing each part just right.
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Predator Goose
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Location: Oversensitive Pedantic Ninny
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:03 pm |
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| another god wrote: |
| Arcade games are simple, Console games are sort of complicated, and PC games are just... well they're PC games. |
Isn't this a bit of an oversimplification?
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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idle
QUAD DAMAGE!!!
Joined: 10 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:12 pm |
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| SuperWes wrote: |
Nothing in this post makes any sense to me. The most popular PC game right now by a large margin is this:
Which is the epitome of Focus-tested, corporate approved game design absolutely slathered in menus, in-game systems, achievements/trophies, unlockables, and DLC, but somehow you think that console games are inelegant messes? Try again. |
Just because PC gaming is a trainwreck doesn't mean console gaming can't be a trainwreck too. I've yet to see anything on a console that rivals that screenshot, but console games are still hardly "simple and elegant". The only titles that come to mind that would qualify as either or both are Katamari Damacy, Pixeljunk Eden, and Mirror's Edge, perhaps. If what I've seen of it is any indication, anyway. I'm sure there are more, but that type of console game is usually the exception rather than the rule.
| Quote: |
Also: your opinion is invalidated when you boycott a game based on the announcement that it will have sequels.
-Wes |
Yeah, I'm such a moron for having principals.
It's just I was all hyped up for the game, ready to buy it day one, and then like two weeks before it hits:
EA: "oh by the way, since you're so excited about this game we're sure you wouldn't mind waiting a couple years of dev time and paying $120 more for the complete mirror's edge experience"
Me: "what the fuck i don't even know if the first game is good yet"
It seemed a bit insulting to me. |
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glossolalia
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:20 pm |
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lol principles
lol principals, for that matter
even though console game mechanics have gotten more crufty, their UIs are still almost always more elegant than "hardcore" computer games.
mirror's edge uses all of four buttons for gameplay in the time trials and most of the story mode. that's pretty simple by modern standards. |
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SuperWes
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:31 pm |
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| another god wrote: |
| I think it's funny that Wes is being corrected on something he said that was wrong (SoT being simple and elegant) in a really horrible shitty way. |
Woah, I never said that SoT was simple and elegant. Not that I don't think it is, but I was responding to the attempt at contrasting "simple and elegant" with "console game." I was comparing console games to PC games, since, in my mind, arcade games sort of got engulfed in the "console" category when they disappeared everywhere in the US outside of California.
Now that I've said what really didn't need to be said, I really would like to know what it is about SoT that you consider inelegant. Seems like movement on one stick, jumping with one button, and an occasional attack with a second is a pretty elegant interface.
-Wes
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another god
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:53 pm |
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I remember playing PoP at my friend's house for an hour or so never getting used to the controls. My friend (who'd beaten the game) took the controller in frustration. He couldn't figure it out either.
Granted this isn't the best way to look at it; I was just saying how ME really is leaps and bounds ahead of anything else as far as controls go. When you're thinking in 3D space, there are really just 6 directions, and I can't really think of a way to communicate those 6 directions better than ME does it.
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SuperWes
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 10:03 pm |
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| another god wrote: |
| I remember playing PoP at my friend's house for an hour or so never getting used to the controls. My friend (who'd beaten the game) took the controller in frustration. He couldn't figure it out either. |
And this is EXACTLY my experience with Mirror's Edge. There's jumps that I feel like I should have made, but for some reason my character would often just fall to her death. Maybe this is less of a disagreement and more of a result of the nature of games. All of our experiences are, by the nature of interactivity, going to be different. If you happen to get really lucky on all of the trial and error parts, your enjoyment would trump mine. We both agree that the game has a great sense of style, but my experience with Mirror's Edge was me drowning in frustration - similar to your experience with Sands of Time.
Alternatively, I work better in 3rd person than first person, or you're willing to put up with more bullshit if you like the aesthetic.
-Wes
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skelethulu
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: OAKLAND
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Victor
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:05 pm |
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| Hell yes to those levels and the people responsible for this videogame. |
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Toto
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:59 am |
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| i froth for this game so hard i could cry. will buy it soon :( |
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Lurky
banned
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2008 12:36 am |
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| idle wrote: |
| Just because PC gaming is a trainwreck doesn't mean console gaming can't be a trainwreck too. |
I agree with this.
Some games are elegant but most aren't. Commercial PC games being a fucking disaster doesn't make console games elegant. |
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jjsimpso
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:39 am |
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I feel like the decline of PC gaming tracks closely with the increasing attention paid to accommodate the existence of identical console versions. PC games which aren't developed as multiplatform games are generally better PC games than those that are(except for MMOs, I will not defend that genre).
There are a number of great PC games still being made by Russian and Eastern European developers who aren't as concerned with the console market: STALKER, King's Bounty, etc.
I distinguish between PC games made to accommodate consoles and console games which happen to have PC versions. The later games can be identified most easily by the fact that they usually play better with a pad than with a keyboard and mouse. Mirror's Edge is a great console game with a PC version. Oblivion is a PC game that is worse because it is multiplatform. The line is starting to blur though. PC games that could have potentially had better interfaces than the console version are now just PC games that play better with a pad. |
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Marshmallow
just call him badass
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 2:24 am |
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My God. This game is beautiful. I love this game. Seriously, this game is looking at being my GOTY 2008.
This game is better than Prince of Persia. |
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Toptube
Anti-cabbage Party Candidate
Joined: 23 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:59 am |
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| jjsimpso wrote: |
I feel like the decline of PC gaming tracks closely with the increasing attention paid to accommodate the existence of identical console versions. PC games which aren't developed as multiplatform games are generally better PC games than those that are(except for MMOs, I will not defend that genre).
There are a number of great PC games still being made by Russian and Eastern European developers who aren't as concerned with the console market: STALKER, King's Bounty, etc.
I distinguish between PC games made to accommodate consoles and console games which happen to have PC versions. The later games can be identified most easily by the fact that they usually play better with a pad than with a keyboard and mouse. Mirror's Edge is a great console game with a PC version. Oblivion is a PC game that is worse because it is multiplatform. The line is starting to blur though. PC games that could have potentially had better interfaces than the console version are now just PC games that play better with a pad. |
The single biggest problem for PC gameing regarding Console to PC and multiplatformed games is mouse lag.
All this damn effort to get these games working across the board and devs seem to be forgetting to polish off the mouse controls. Every. Damn. Tiime. I think every major multiplatform release or console to PC port this generation has had noticeable if not terrible mouse lag.
It seems to be a combonation of 2 things:
not optimizing the engine to work well with V-sync (disabling V-sync in said game usually helps with the mouse lage a lot, but then you have tearing)
and then just generally not fixing up how the game responds to mouse input. Maybe its just an oversight, maybe its a lazy way to avoid adjusting the difficulty----who knows. It sucks.
I have some Faith in the PC port of Mirror's Edge because its being delayed so much. Hopefully EA heard the cries of Deadspace PC users. |
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