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Halo isn't boring me this time
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Tokyo Rude



Joined: 28 Mar 2007
Location: I'm on the phone Derrick!

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 6:23 pm    Post subject: Halo isn't boring me this time    Reply with quote

Hey dudes. I once made a thread On an old forum about Halo. I felt like shooting some stuff and found that a copy of the Legendary Halo 1 and 2 Pack for 1000 yen. So now I'm sitting here at the exact same part I quit last time, playing Halo.

It's not bad.

Please discuss Peter Moore's life in this thread.
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another coma
NeoGAF Reject


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: the wrong museum

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:35 pm        Reply with quote

I hate Peter Moore is Boreing?
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Chuplayer
agalmatophile


Joined: 23 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:40 pm        Reply with quote

I actually found that sniper level to be one of the better parts of Halo 1. It was a breath of fresh air, at least until it degenerated into a shootout where your squad of space marines dies out quickly and you're left to fight alone.

I hated that about Halo. Sometimes you start with these big squads of soldiers, and all of a sudden it's just you. I liked the chatter between the troops a lot, and the solo action just lacks personality.
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Mr. Mechanical
ontological terrorist


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: Scare Room 99

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:08 pm        Reply with quote

Brotip your squad mates don't die as often if you fire on the same targets that they're firing on.
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Chuplayer
agalmatophile


Joined: 23 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:11 pm        Reply with quote

Mr. Mechanical wrote:
Brotip your squad mates don't die as often if you fire on the same targets that they're firing on.


But sometimes you're just forced to fight on your own, and there are oodles of enemies, and stuff.
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Judge Ito



Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: IA

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:26 pm        Reply with quote

Chuplayer wrote:
Mr. Mechanical wrote:
Brotip your squad mates don't die as often if you fire on the same targets that they're firing on.


But sometimes you're just forced to fight on your own, and there are oodles of enemies, and stuff.


You're a super-powered space-cyborg marine (spacyborine) and they're grunts with armor. It's a device to show you just how powerful you're supposed to be that you can take on an entire alien army by yourself.
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Chuplayer
agalmatophile


Joined: 23 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:04 pm        Reply with quote

Judge Ito wrote:
Chuplayer wrote:
Mr. Mechanical wrote:
Brotip your squad mates don't die as often if you fire on the same targets that they're firing on.


But sometimes you're just forced to fight on your own, and there are oodles of enemies, and stuff.


You're a super-powered space-cyborg marine (spacyborine) and they're grunts with armor. It's a device to show you just how powerful you're supposed to be that you can take on an entire alien army by yourself.


And it's booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooring.
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Dracko
a sapphist fool


Joined: 06 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:30 pm        Reply with quote

No it isn't.
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Max Cola



Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Location: a shotgun shack

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:37 pm        Reply with quote

LOOK EVERYONE IT'S DRACKO WITH ANOTHER AMAAAAAAAAAZING COUNTER-ARGUMENT
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BEIGE



Joined: 04 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:01 pm        Reply with quote

Hit 'em, marines! Go, go, go! The Corps ain't payin' us by the hour!
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dessgeega
damaged


Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:02 pm        Reply with quote

Max Cola wrote:
WHOAAAAAAAAAAH!


for some reason lately i've had the desire to give the original halo a try. i played through it briefly with a friend years ago on probably super easy difficulty.
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boojiboy7
narcissistic irony-laden twat


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: take me on a blatant doom trip.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:09 pm        Reply with quote

play it on the highest or second highest difficulty co-op with someone dess. this is really how it should be played.
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Chuplayer
agalmatophile


Joined: 23 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:15 pm        Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
No it isn't.


Two words: The Library.
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Greng



Joined: 27 Sep 2007
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, Engerland

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:24 pm        Reply with quote

I enjoyed the library level most... don't think ANYONE liked that bit but me. Relentless waves of flood; good times.
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Mr. Apol
king of zembla


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: a curiously familiar pit

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:24 pm        Reply with quote

dessgeega wrote:
Max Cola wrote:
WHOAAAAAAAAAAH!


for some reason lately i've had the desire to give the original halo a try. i played through it briefly with a friend years ago on probably super easy difficulty.


it's not a bad game! i had a lot of fun with it back in its hey-day. i didn't really get into 2 or 3, but the first halo is a very solid game.
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Dracko
a sapphist fool


Joined: 06 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:34 pm        Reply with quote

Max Cola wrote:
LOOK EVERYONE IT'S DRACKO WITH ANOTHER AMAAAAAAAAAZING COUNTER-ARGUMENT

My counter-argument is usually your argument is wrong, yes.

The Library is fucking awesome, unless you hate DooM or something.
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Slonie



Joined: 07 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 2:05 am        Reply with quote

The Library was plenty of fun with the hammer-of-god shotgun from Halo 1.
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wasted potential



Joined: 19 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:05 am        Reply with quote

does youtube have a vid of Captain Keyes turning into the flood
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SuperWes



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:14 am        Reply with quote

Halo 1 definitely has the best single player of the series, but (and I'm going to be crucified for this) the multiplayer is unbalanced and far too focused on gunfights over strategy. Halo 2 has the worst single player of the series for sure, but it's got great multiplayer. Halo 3 is probably the best in the series overall simply because it has a pretty good single player and online multiplayer that does pretty much everything imaginable. Being able to modify maps is superb, and with the update that's due out in a week or so it'll be even more versatile!

Uhh, if you play Halo 3 online at all check my fileshare for a few funky maps.

-Wes
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Marshmallow
just call him badass


Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:34 am        Reply with quote

The Halo 2 multiplayer was broken as all hell. I'd rather play the first game multiplayer than that mess!

I'm not sure if I think Halo 1 or 3 is the best in the series... I guess Halo 3 gets bonus points for the sheer amount of cotent, but I feel the original game is more refined. Halo 2 is quite rubbish and it's a shame Halo 3 had to deal with all the bullshit it brought to the table.
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Daphaknee
a whole shitload of class


Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Location: nickel dime

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:43 am        Reply with quote

dude dess lets play co-op halo when you get here that game is fun

ADD IT TO THE HUGE PILE OF THINGS TO DO
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Intentionally Wrong



Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:40 am        Reply with quote

SuperWes wrote:
Halo 1 definitely has the best single player of the series, but (and I'm going to be crucified for this) the multiplayer is unbalanced and far too focused on gunfights over strategy. Halo 2 has the worst single player of the series for sure, but it's got great multiplayer. Halo 3 is probably the best in the series overall simply because it has a pretty good single player and online multiplayer that does pretty much everything imaginable. Being able to modify maps is superb, and with the update that's due out in a week or so it'll be even more versatile!

Uhh, if you play Halo 3 online at all check my fileshare for a few funky maps.

-Wes


Wes gets it.

Halo 2's multiplayer only "sucks" if you insist on it "living up" to the standard set by Halo 1. The standard set by Halo 1 is broken, though, and Halo 2 rewards the gamer who understands this.
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Family Computer



Joined: 17 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:46 am        Reply with quote

I was thinking about this game earlier actually. I was thinking about how repetitive the level designs are and how it had to have been a design choice made by Bungie on purpose. The Library and the levels in which you go through previous levels backwards, almost seem like commentaries on this, taking the repetition to it's extreme.

I can't figure out why they would have wanted to do things like that.

Maybe they just ran out of time instead.
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Marshmallow
just call him badass


Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:46 am        Reply with quote

what the fuck are you talking about. halo 2 was exploitable as all hell, that's why it was broken! halo 1 was unbalanced, sure, but it wasn't nearly as exploitable as halo 2.
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Harveyjames



Joined: 11 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:13 am        Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
Max Cola wrote:
LOOK EVERYONE IT'S DRACKO WITH ANOTHER AMAAAAAAAAAZING COUNTER-ARGUMENT

My counter-argument is usually your argument is wrong, yes.


That's not really an argument, Dracko
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Marshmallow
just call him badass


Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:16 am        Reply with quote

I'd argue that it is.
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dessgeega
damaged


Joined: 05 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:22 am        Reply with quote


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WarpZone



Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:31 am        Reply with quote

Family Computer wrote:
I was thinking about how repetitive the level designs are and how it had to have been a design choice made by Bungie on purpose. The Library and the levels in which you go through previous levels backwards, almost seem like commentaries on this, taking the repetition to it's extreme.


I think the library was pretty obviously meant to be an endurance test (though an overlong one), but I've never understood the complaints of repetition in the following levels. Do enemy selection and placement not qualify as level design, particularly in a game based almost entirely around the exchanges of you and the enemy? The combat situation, the tone, the whole context is different when returning to these places. They do look the same...except for all the damage and chaos everywhere.

Actually I think those last few levels are the best part of the series. They do a bunch of interesting things the sequels mostly ignored. The Silent Cartographer is great, too, its structure kind of a microcosm of the game as a whole.
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SuperWes



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 2:24 pm        Reply with quote

Cycle wrote:
what the fuck are you talking about. halo 2 was exploitable as all hell, that's why it was broken! halo 1 was unbalanced, sure, but it wasn't nearly as exploitable as halo 2.

What does it mean to be exploitable? Other than sweep sniping, super jumps, and the BR/Plasma pistol combo I can't think of anything that isn't easily counterable if you know what you're doing and have a bit of skill, and aside from Super Jumps, all of those are pretty easy to counter if you know what you're doing. Can you give me a few examples of what you're talking about?

Also, I'm pretty sure Halo 1 would have been just as "exploitable" if it had had online play. With just offline there's less of an incentive for people to be "inventive" in their game breaking. Regardless, I don't know how anyone can justify starting everyone with a pistol that kills in one shot and can be zoomed in.

-Wes
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Maztorre



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: Ireland

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 2:59 pm        Reply with quote

It's kind of sad that Silent Cartographer is still the peak of the series in terms of level design and overall game structure. There's quite a straightforward formula to that section in terms of pacing and flow that Bungie abandoned in Halo 2 and didn't quite reach again in Halo 3. Gears of War, for example, is far better constructed around its central gameplay hook compared to Halo. Gears 2 looks like the opposite of what happened to the Halo sequels: it remains confident in the strength of its core gameplay and builds new game modes and adds to/balances the weaponry around that central hook. What Bungie did with their game mechanics in Halo 2/3 is ridiculous in hindsight.

The Halo series would probably have been a lot better had it launched on PC with decent mod tools. For one, they probably would have been hiring actual level designers from the community instead of 1Up writers onto their staff.
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boojiboy7
narcissistic irony-laden twat


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: take me on a blatant doom trip.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:05 pm        Reply with quote

I thought 3 had a few levels that got close to Silent Cartographer. The Ark and the Covenant were both really well done and paced, building up to nice fights at the end. The one before the flood crash also really plays on Halo's strengths, having big open areas and letting the AI do it's thing so that the fight plays out in its own way each time.
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Harveyjames



Joined: 11 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:13 pm        Reply with quote

Cycle wrote:
I'd argue that it is.


No you wouldn't.
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Maztorre



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: Ireland

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:19 pm        Reply with quote

boojiboy7 wrote:
I thought 3 had a few levels that got close to Silent Cartographer. The Ark and the Covenant were both really well done and paced, building up to nice fights at the end. The one before the flood crash also really plays on Halo's strengths, having big open areas and letting the AI do it's thing so that the fight plays out in its own way each time.


Yeah, 3 does strive for the same kind of gameplay again, but there's just so much fluff and bullshit going on around it just so you can get to those good parts, and a lot of it feels like legacy Halo 2 nonsense that they couldn't (wouldn't?) get rid of. By contrast Silent Cartographer is really pure and still feels extremely fresh, especially since the transitioning between exterior and interior fighting, and from on-foot to vehicle, occurs so naturally to the player. The sequels fail at making your choices seem natural, especially since they muddy the waters with linearity and scripting instead of letting the player have fun with the AI (the whole draw of the series).
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boojiboy7
narcissistic irony-laden twat


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: take me on a blatant doom trip.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:26 pm        Reply with quote

I thought the centerpiece fights with the giant walker things in 3 were really a highlight of the Halo style though. The one where you fight two at once in Covenant is perfect for this, because you can get the AI to do some wonderful things there. That level also had some good transitions between the up close, hall battles, and the big outdoor warzones that made SC such a fun level for me.

I guess I didn't sense as much scripting as you did. There were some scripted events, but a lot of it was just letting shit fly in the way Halo does. The most scripting I saw was usually in service of starting the fight, and the game just letting you fill in the rest.
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Dracko
a sapphist fool


Joined: 06 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:53 pm        Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
Dracko wrote:
Max Cola wrote:
LOOK EVERYONE IT'S DRACKO WITH ANOTHER AMAAAAAAAAAZING COUNTER-ARGUMENT

My counter-argument is usually your argument is wrong, yes.


That's not really an argument, Dracko

My other counter-argument is you're not really worth the hassle.

More PC: "I know what I like."
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The New Ska



Joined: 09 Oct 2007

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:55 pm        Reply with quote

SuperWes wrote:
Cycle wrote:
what the fuck are you talking about. halo 2 was exploitable as all hell, that's why it was broken! halo 1 was unbalanced, sure, but it wasn't nearly as exploitable as halo 2.

What does it mean to be exploitable? Other than sweep sniping, super jumps, and the BR/Plasma pistol combo I can't think of anything that isn't easily counterable if you know what you're doing and have a bit of skill, and aside from Super Jumps, all of those are pretty easy to counter if you know what you're doing. Can you give me a few examples of what you're talking about?

Also, I'm pretty sure Halo 1 would have been just as "exploitable" if it had had online play. With just offline there's less of an incentive for people to be "inventive" in their game breaking. Regardless, I don't know how anyone can justify starting everyone with a pistol that kills in one shot and can be zoomed in.

-Wes


yeah um, let's not talk about this ok. people are getting queasy.
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Dark Age Iron Savior
king of finders


Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Location: Spacecraft, Juanelia Country

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:33 pm        Reply with quote

Guys tell me about co-op with the PC version.
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SuperWes



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: St. Louis, Missouri

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:36 pm        Reply with quote

The New Ska wrote:
SuperWes wrote:
Cycle wrote:
what the fuck are you talking about. halo 2 was exploitable as all hell, that's why it was broken! halo 1 was unbalanced, sure, but it wasn't nearly as exploitable as halo 2.

What does it mean to be exploitable? Other than sweep sniping, super jumps, and the BR/Plasma pistol combo I can't think of anything that isn't easily counterable if you know what you're doing and have a bit of skill, and aside from Super Jumps, all of those are pretty easy to counter if you know what you're doing. Can you give me a few examples of what you're talking about?

Also, I'm pretty sure Halo 1 would have been just as "exploitable" if it had had online play. With just offline there's less of an incentive for people to be "inventive" in their game breaking. Regardless, I don't know how anyone can justify starting everyone with a pistol that kills in one shot and can be zoomed in.

-Wes


yeah um, let's not talk about this ok. people are getting queasy.

:( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

But I've always wanted a straight answer about why people who are in love with Halo 1 multiplayer don't like Halo 2. Maybe there's something I'm missing.

-Wes
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notext



Joined: 06 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:40 pm        Reply with quote

The sheer amount of stuff in Halo 3 kind of works against it in a way, just because there are so many things that feel underdeveloped. Hunters don't get nearly enough playtime, neither does the spartan laser, the covenant go out with a whimper rather than a bang and I never thought I'd say this but there wasn't nearly enough of the flood. (That is, not enough of them in the confined spaces they belong in, and no real three-way battle situations going on). Part of this could be uncharitably (not unreasonably) put down to the design, but I really think there just wasn't room for all the cool stuff to come into play.

Basically what I'm saying is that if Bungie did a few big single-player levels as well as the multiplayer ones they keep spewing out I'd be a very happy boy.

(And yeah, the game still had plenty of Halo 2 bullshit, although somehow they arranged it so you weren't tripping over energy swords and shotguns and other instant-kill weapons every two seconds. Which is probably why the spartan laser doesn't get more play. Still, would've been nice!)

(Halo 2 was a good game, despite everything. My main problem being the great big sucking hole in the middle where Bungie actually decided they should do the Library again, only bigger and less interesting. And the prominence of power weapons that made all the Elites into wusses. Still good times to be had!)
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The New Ska



Joined: 09 Oct 2007

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:44 pm        Reply with quote

Quote:
:( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

But I've always wanted a straight answer about why people who are in love with Halo 1 multiplayer don't like Halo 2. Maybe there's something I'm missing.


it's slower, less clicky.

think: pow pow pow vs schlunk schlunk schlunk schlunk

the original halo is Doom. the later games slowed pace down further and added complexity to a core that was pretty much fine without it. also the halo series is sort of based on a lie, as its trinity of grenade, punch, shoot was weakened as people became more used to the dual analog setup.

this all assuming you go deep enough to discover the heart of it all, which is something that you should never, ever do.
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Greng



Joined: 27 Sep 2007
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, Engerland

PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:54 pm        Reply with quote

I liked driving the warthog as far down the silent cartographers complex as I could. Not as far as I'd hoped but it was good times anyway.

I love that level name.
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