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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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 Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 4:58 am |
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| negativedge wrote: |
| Bush, though I guess he found Jesus late in life or whatever, was a rich partier from an elite family that went to Yale. On paper, that doesn't exactly scream "Bible Belt" to me. |
That's a common perception and a big misconception. He was marketed very successfully to evangelicals and marketing is all that matters. More importantly, he really did find Jesus late in life and the thing about Christians is that once you accept the Lord the rest of your life doesn't matter. (Politically of course this is untenable - your history forms your habits, which we have seen all over Bush's presidency - but try telling that to a Bible-thumper.) Critically, I think Schwarzenegger wouldn't have the patience for that nonsense, even assuming he was willing to be sold that way, which I doubt. As I said before, if that was the GOP's strategy they'd choose a candidate better suited for it, like Huckabee.
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negativedge
banned
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:05 am |
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| Yeah, he was sold that way. They could try it with anyone. Though, as you seem to agree, I don't think they'd really try it. There are a lot of ways to win an election. Arnold would essentially run on the democratic strategy of trying to poach moderate voters from the other party. That his background is, uhhh, entertaining and his policies contrarian would probably help him here. The Bible thumpers probably wouldn't break either way, and if they did it'd likely be for different reasons. Which would be nice. |
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Broco
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: Headquarters
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:35 am |
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| Debates can usually be spun at will to say either candidate "won", but this time I'm not seeing a single commentator, right or left, who thinks that McCain won. The range of opinion goes between crushing victory for Obama, to neutral (which of course is not sufficient). McCain was vague, geriatric and bitter, while Obama was precise, confident, and his attacks much more potent. |
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rabite gets whacked!
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:39 am |
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Guys I just realized the next likely republican power player may well be Lieberman.
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negativedge
banned
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:44 am |
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| Lieberman doesn't appeal to anyone outside of Connecticut. |
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rabite gets whacked!
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:49 am |
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That's cause he's still "independent."
But the republicans namedrop him like crazy already, and there'd surely be some clout running a converted ex-democratic senator.
More than Romney or Giuliani, anyway.
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scratchmonkey
Final Finasty
Joined: 21 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:01 am |
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He'd also incense the evangelicals unless he converted, and I don't mean turning into a Republican.
Because as sad as it is, teh j0000000000000000000000z still doesn't play well in Peoria. |
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negativedge
banned
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:43 am |
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| In this age of "flip flopper lol" I don't think party swapping would go over too well. That and he's a northeastern Jew and about a hundred years old. I don't see how he appeals to Republicans at all. |
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secondpillow
Joined: 15 Jan 2007
Location: Orlando
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:56 am |
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I want a Schwarzenegger vs. John Waters debate. They don't even have to be really running for the presidency; they can pretend.
I watched tonight's debate with the man who created Stick Stickly. I tried to buy him a beer, but he wouldn't let me. |
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another coma
NeoGAF Reject
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: the wrong museum
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:59 am |
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| secondpillow wrote: |
| I tried to buy him a beer, but he wouldn't let me. |
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rabite gets whacked!
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:04 am |
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| Vehicular Manslaughter wrote: |
Because as sad as it is, teh j0000000000000000000000z still doesn't play well in Peoria. |
That's true. Though ticket him with Huckabee...
Every time I think of Romney running as a Mormon I have a little chuckle.
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Ebrey
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:36 am |
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The only reason Lieberman won his last election is that most of Connecticut's Republicans voted for him (the actual Republican candidate got 10% of the vote), as did all of the people who vote for him year after year. Since national voters aren't used to voting for Lieberman, that trick wouldn't work.
Arnold would be a fun president. |
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UnitedBiscuits
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:36 pm |
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| I recorded and just watched this whole thing this morning. McCain really didn't make a new case for his candidacy, which is what he probably needed to do at this point. In the meantime, his repeated attacks make him look desperate and contradict his bipartisan claims. And of course his facts, his rhetoric, and his policy prescriptions are riddled with contradictions, which I'm sure we'll all laugh at when its spliced together on the Daily Show. Meanwhile Obama looked calm, confident, and presidential. And he continued to admit where he agreed with McCain, which I think was smart - it shows it wasn't a mistake last time, and demonstrates not just a willingness to look for common ground, but shows he is "bipartisan" in his thought process, which he rightly perceives as one of his biggest strengths. In the end it was yet another debate of talking points, and while I try to remain optimistic about Obama, it has already shaped up to be politics as usual. It did long ago and I should have realized it midway between sending my hard earned dollars to the campaign. Obama will win and on November 5th we the world will rejoice, but some time in Spring, the collective soul of the world will let out a long a unbearable apathetic sigh as they look and see that nothing has changed and that for the moment, the color of the skin of the disappointment in power does not matter. |
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Internetics
Joined: 19 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:16 pm |
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Having them walk around really helped drive home the fact that one of them is 47, and the other is 72. McCain's old "war injuries" around his arms and shoulders prevented him from any younger. The arthritis and general aging problems have to be a part of it.
If they released his medical history to the public, the very real threat of him dying in office would be realized by the American people. Palin as the face of American politics, the face that meets world leaders and addresses the UN just freaks me out. Because it's too impossible to not come true.
The one-minute rule was good, but Brokaw couldn't keep two kittens on a chair if his life depended on it. I hate that both parties agreed on a 31-page list of rules, then just went on thier own way of talking for 3 minutes and jumping over questions and follow-ups and shit.
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dementia
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:19 pm |
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| negativedge wrote: |
| Thank you, CNN. |
I don't get your post. News outlets typically make the race seem closer than it really is to increase ratings. |
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:32 pm |
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| UnitedBiscuits wrote: |
| In the end it was yet another debate of talking points, and while I try to remain optimistic about Obama, it has already shaped up to be politics as usual. It did long ago and I should have realized it midway between sending my hard earned dollars to the campaign. Obama will win and on November 5th we the world will rejoice, but some time in Spring, the collective soul of the world will let out a long a unbearable apathetic sigh as they look and see that nothing has changed and that for the moment, the color of the skin of the disappointment in power does not matter. |
CookiesAreOne, I feel you.
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Talbain
Joined: 14 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:16 pm |
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Yay bureaucracy! I'm sure all our problems will be solved! Or maybe another depression! Who knows! 4 more years!
Honestly, why are we even calling these debates? Can't we just call it stump speeches express and move on to why glowing lab mice won the Nobel prize?
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sawtooth
heh
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: flashback
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 8:37 pm |
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ron paul 2008
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Renfrew
catchy, and giger-esque
Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Location: Hometown: America
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:34 pm |
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There was something interesting after the debate. CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that.
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manmachine plays jazz
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:51 pm |
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| Renfrew wrote: |
| There was something interesting after the debate. CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that. |
that 25 people is a horribly unrepresentative sample? |
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Renfrew
catchy, and giger-esque
Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Location: Hometown: America
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:11 pm |
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| manmachine plays jazz wrote: |
| Renfrew wrote: |
| There was something interesting after the debate. CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that. |
that 25 people is a horribly unrepresentative sample? |
Of course it is but that's not what I was talking about. I was more perplexed by the disassociation between the "debate winner" and the vote getter.
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negativedge
banned
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:15 pm |
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| Well, I don't think we elect presidents to win debates, personally. Nor are these debates anything but total farce. |
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Predator Goose
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Location: Oversensitive Pedantic Ninny
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:17 pm |
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| Renfrew wrote: |
| manmachine plays jazz wrote: |
| Renfrew wrote: |
| There was something interesting after the debate. CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that. |
that 25 people is a horribly unrepresentative sample? |
Of course it is but that's not what I was talking about. I was more perplexed by the disassociation between the "debate winner" and the vote getter. |
Man go back and watch Bush v Gore or Bush v Kerry debates. The man was a dead fish, half the time merely responding that he agreed with the other guy.
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manmachine plays jazz
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:48 pm |
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| Renfrew wrote: |
| manmachine plays jazz wrote: |
| Renfrew wrote: |
| There was something interesting after the debate. CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that. |
that 25 people is a horribly unrepresentative sample? |
Of course it is but that's not what I was talking about. I was more perplexed by the disassociation between the "debate winner" and the vote getter. |
ohio |
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negativedge
banned
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:22 am |
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| Yeah man, fuck that state that doesn't uniformly agree with me. |
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DonMarco
graphics fucker
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 1:06 am |
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| Renfrew wrote: |
| CNN had 25 undecided Ohio voters in a room. They asked them who did better in the debate and I think 12 raised there hand for Obama and 10 for McCain. After that, they asked if they were forced to vote today, who would they vote for, and it was 15 for McCain and 10 for Obama. I don't really know what to make of that. |
They thought Obama did better, but not enough to sway earn their vote.
25 voters is as accurate as 250,000. In the end, it doesn't mean a fucking thing. Polls are never accurate. Never.
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BalbanesBeoulve
Malicious Bastard
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:53 am |
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Take a statistics class, plz.
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DonMarco
graphics fucker
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:46 am |
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Prove to me any time an exit poll or phone poll has been more accurate than the actual election results.
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Predator Goose
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Location: Oversensitive Pedantic Ninny
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:08 pm |
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| DonMarco wrote: |
| Prove to me any time an exit poll or phone poll has been more accurate than the actual election results. |
Ohio 2004, exit polling shows Kerry winning the state. Diebold machines were used in that state. If you recall, voting machines in general, and Diebold in particular, have been criticized as being highly susceptible to tampering. One of Bush's campaign managers was the Secretary of State in Ohio, overseeing the election. The chairman of Diebold is on record in that election cycle as saying that he would do whatever he could to ensure that Bush won the election.
Not enough to prove anything, there's nothing here that constitutes a logical causal link. But it is enough to scratch your head over.
Edit: Oh, and Ohio apparently pulled some precinct wankery on us where it was decreed from on high that your vote didn't count if it wasn't cast in the precinct where you lived. And oh yeah, lets redraw those precinct lines so you don't have any idea where the fuck to go.
Edit Edit: Man, how can I forget the storied history of the disenfranchisment of minority voters? Or stuffing the ballot box with votes from deceased people?
To make it much shorter, actual election results are less trustworthy that we'd like to believe.
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Tokyo Rude
Joined: 28 Mar 2007
Location: I'm on the phone Derrick!
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| Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:25 pm |
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| I asked for my absentee ballot a month ago and still haven't got it guess I'm not voting. |
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sawtooth
heh
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: flashback
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:07 am |
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I don't think these people know what a terrorist is.
Not used to attacks from them, I guess.
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BalbanesBeoulve
Malicious Bastard
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:30 am |
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| Dracko wrote: |
I don't think these people know what a terrorist is.
Not used to attacks from them, I guess. |
Yeah, this is getting fucking ridiculous. McCain's really a piece of shit, not condemning this stuff, even as people yell "kill him!" and "hang him!" during speeches.
At this point he's just ruining his reputation, it's certainly not helping him in the polls.
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shrugtheironteacup
man of tomorrow
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Location: a meat
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:36 am |
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| Dracko wrote: |
I don't think these people know what a terrorist is.
Not used to attacks from them, I guess. |
The guy at :54 is amazing.
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:44 am |
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needs more trozz
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:46 am |
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I bet Trozz votes McCain too.
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BalbanesBeoulve
Malicious Bastard
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:48 am |
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:16 am |
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| Dracko wrote: |
I don't think these people know what a terrorist is.
Not used to attacks from them, I guess. |
guys Bethlehem Pa is my hometown
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:37 am |
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fffffffffffffffffffffff
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shrugtheironteacup
man of tomorrow
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Location: a meat
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:06 am |
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| Dracko wrote: |
| needs more trozz |
| Dracko wrote: |
| I bet Trozz votes McCain too. |
Trozz likes neither candidate.
His Trozz wife really likes Palin.
Because Alaska, I guess.
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:10 am |
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| Dracko wrote: |
| fffffffffffffffffffffff |
I shit you not
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