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Demon's Souls
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:04 am        Reply with quote

Well, you should still check out the artwork. The stuff's too great to pass up.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:16 am        Reply with quote

Renfrew wrote:
I saw a couple of there glowing blue lizard things. What's up with that?

Is this rhetorical or do you really want to know?
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 11:55 am        Reply with quote

Mm... no, the Cling Ring doesn't prevent invasions, as far as I know.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 6:26 am        Reply with quote

Swords don't penetrate walls either, but they do have odd hitboxes (which is to say that a sword can hit and have the wall hitting animation occur). The only enemy that I think is blatantly allowed to swing and hit regardless of terrain are the big goblins in Stage 5. I suppose the Black Phantom who carries the Meat Cleaver is also allowed to run, but so are all enemies in swamps, while you can only trudge. This kind of irked me, but the enemies really are at a disadvantage and this makes up for it somewhat.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 10:29 pm        Reply with quote

Ronnoc wrote:
Beat 1-1, but not with the character I actually want to play the game as :3

I still have trouble with this. There's just so many ways to play the game, I think I remade my character 3 or 4 times before I was happy and stuck with the character I was playing. My first playthrough was a Royal, and that later evolved into playing a Temple Knight with an early Meat Cleaver. It's strange, but I found it easier to play with a weapon than with spells after a certain point, even though I never really enjoyed being crazy vulnerable after a swing.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:43 am        Reply with quote

CubaLibre wrote:
Shields are great and a real lifesaver, playing without one is basically like playing hard mode. BUT there are a lot of big enemies/strong attacks that can't be blocked or at least are inefficient and harmful to block. The sooner you learn about dodging the sooner you'll be prepared for the harder stages.

I've tended to find that running away can also be a super useful solution, particularly when multiple enemies become an issue. Was actually a technique employed by samurai and assassins often, running away and then killing the faster foes, and then continually doing that. Tended to find it most useful in 5-2 where there are some packs of those bigger Goblins, also similarly works in 5-1 when acquiring Istarelle.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 4:29 am        Reply with quote

I actually thought Maneater was quite easy, so I have a hard time sharing your opinion that he was a difficult boss Felix. What was it that got you on him? I absolutely hated 5-1 and 5-2 and could not believe how many times I died to the environment (the bosses were, admittedly, kind of a joke). That said, I never did spend much time with life regen, and I always preferred the Dark Silver Shield over Adjudicator. Maybe it was the fact that I didn't have the regen, but for me it was never the poison that got me, it was more typically the huge goblins (trudging through the goop certainly didn't help).
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 6:44 am        Reply with quote

Yeah, I don't think I've ever died on Adjudicator. It's one of those weird fights for me though. I often get near death when I fight him, due to the way the fight progresses, but I rarely ever worry about it. I guess it's just that Adjudicator feels really predictable and that predictability lets me get in more often. Flamelurker was the same way for me for a time, but once I figured out how to strafe him correctly, I rarely die more than once (though admittedly, because my first character was a magic user, Flamelurker was a joke, as was Maneater, and only later when I came back with more physical characters did I appreciate their difficulty, though again, I still had considerably less trouble with Maneater, I think because I knew about the Meat Cleaver and how exceptionally effective it is against everything).

Personally, the fight I've had the most trouble with has always been Storm Ruler. I don't even know why, most people tell me it's a relatively simple fight, but maybe it's just because of the way I approach the fight that I've never been able to get that fight down. Even Allant, after a while, becomes somewhat predictable, but due to the angles at which those barbs come at you, I've never been able to figure out when it's "safe" and when it's not (ironically, the first time I played through, with my magic character, I beat him on the first try, but when I played with my more physical characters, I tend to die seven or eight times before I down the bugger). I think I have trouble with aerial enemies in Demon's/Dark Souls in general though.

Garl and Maiden Astraea is probably my new favorite boss fight. It's just a really immaculately well made fight, and one that I simply will not be able to forget or stop talking about. Everything, from the execution to the way in which you approach the fight just feels right. Even when you figure things out, it doesn't always go as planned, and every time I enter that doorway, I feel like giving pause. It's just exceptionally striking, visually, audially, kinesthetically. Something that can't really be described, you just have to get there and experience it to really appreciate it. A rare moment where I've been able to appreciate the medium.

Thanks Felix for the explanation.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:58 pm        Reply with quote

Vehicular Manslaughter wrote:
Storm King is easily cheesed by running behind the ruined building in that stage when he fires off the barbs. I imagine you just have to take a lot of pain otherwise.

I don't think I ever discovered where this was. I need to explore that boss stage more I guess. I mostly spend my time spamming Full Moon Grass to not die from constantly getting thwacked.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:46 am        Reply with quote

Man, how nuts would it be if they announced the PC port of both of these games and not just Dark Souls? I mean... yeah, seriously, From Software would just get a free pass on whatever they do for a while I think.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:37 pm        Reply with quote

I agree with the sentiment, but I hope you're both wrong.

I don't really want DLC for these games, I don't think I've ever felt that DLC added to a game in a way that didn't feel tacked on, and, what's more, that added to the connectedness of the world. I suppose we'll know what's going on in April.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:18 am        Reply with quote

I will see you all on the 31st... so sad.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:01 am        Reply with quote

I dunno, I tend to think of them as being different rather than one being better, particularly that everyone who had experience with Demon's Souls knew, to a certain degree, what to expect when coming into Dark. From what I can tell, introducing Dark to a person who hasn't played Demon's is far tougher mostly from a navigational standpoint. In Demon's Souls the game is very straightforward about what's expected of you and where you're supposed to go. My brother spent a good three hours in the Dark Souls starting area before figuring out that fighting the skeletons wasn't the right way to go, but given that it was the obvious way to him at the time, he spent a long time dying there before attempting a different path. When I played Dark Souls blind, there were areas I was absolutely terrified of due to not knowing where the next rest point was. Playing Dark Souls blind makes you appreciate the brilliance of its waypoint system immensely, whereas Demon's rest points feel very forgiving (though this is playing both blind, I suppose your mileage may vary depending on how you played it). While it's true that Dark Souls had nothing like 4-1, Demon's Souls has nothing that's like the Painted World, and the Painted World is by far my favorite area in any game. Still, there is also nothing like Maiden Astraea in Dark Souls, the closest to it might be the Artorias fight/post-battle encounter. Again, they are games of differences, and each is extraordinarily rich, both with a different mythos and pathos to consider.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:47 am        Reply with quote

diplo wrote:
I don't know why you read my post as being about which game is better/worse.

Apologies, an assumption on my part from the harder/not as hard statement at the beginning. Though again, I don't really think one is more difficult than the other either, as while the mechanics are similar, the difficulty of both comes from different sources, and I feel navigation in Dark Souls is a considerable part of that, while fights have more nuance in Dark due to the greater variety of enemy types, particularly gargoyles/dragons/Anor Londo Giant Knights.

The only boss that I thought was a real pain in the butt in Demon's Souls was False King, and there's a definite parallel between him and Artorias in terms of the aggressive fighting style (though of the two I would say that Artorias is far less relenting). Ornstein and Smough are also immensely more difficult than Maneater, though I'm sure people will disagree with me.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 2:28 am        Reply with quote

Felix wrote:
Maneater and O&S both took me about as long (2+ hours) the first time around, but I've since been able to mop the floor with O&S whereas I haven't returned to Demon's (where, in my one playthrough, I used that crescent falchion for almost the entire game).

I had a pretty different experience, where the first time I fought Maneater I beat them on my first shot, whereas the first shot of O&S took me three tries and subsequent attempts greatly varied in success (with the toughest battle being when I was two-handing Gravelord Sword with Havel's armor and fat-rolling). Subsequent attempts at Maneater never took me more than one or two tries, and often I defeated him the first time. The Tower of Latria in general was one of the easiest areas in the game for me, but I think it's probably my favorite place in Demon's Souls overall.

Flameater and False King took me the most time to beat on my initial playthrough, the rest of the bosses were relatively trivial (don't take this as them being easy, just relative to Flameater and False King, they weren't super difficult for me).

Toptube wrote:
Talbain wrote:
Playing Dark Souls blind makes you appreciate the brilliance of its waypoint system immensely, whereas Demon's rest points feel very forgiving (though this is playing both blind, I suppose your mileage may vary depending on how you played it).


I Disagree on the plain fact that Demon's souls makes you fight a boss before you get to the next "rest" point. Dark Souls often does not and many times even has rest points fairly near boss rooms.

Dark Souls probably makes you feel a little more "weathered" (for lack of a better term) becaus it makes you walk/run to nearly every place you want to go, for most of the game. It takes up a lot more of your time just getting around. Demon's Souls is still more difficult in context of its "rest" points.

Yeah, but that's my point. You know you're getting that rest point after you beat the boss, and that's really comforting. Sure you have to fight for it, but once the shortcuts in any given level are opened up it's a hop skip and a jump to any given boss in Demon's Souls. Not knowing where the next rest point is after a boss is terrifying after you've just netted all those souls, and unless you're willing to Homeward Bone (note, on my first playthrough I almost never used them, simply because I wasn't even aware they existed), it's really difficult to make a decision about moving forward (where there is ostensibly a rest point somewhere) or going back to where you know you can rest and use your souls.

Toptube, I agree that the World Tendency system is fantastic and I really wish they would bring it (or something like it) back. While I like the covenant system as well, I think the tendency system as a construction for accessing places and enemies is really interesting, and adds mystery and interesting nooks to the game (not that Dark Souls doesn't have either of these, but the tendency system is a really rewarding way to approach the concept of alignment through play - though maybe they could make it so that it's a bit less easy to manipulate via killing oneself in a place like The Nexus).
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 2:52 am        Reply with quote

Felix wrote:
Whereas both Flamelurker and False King were relatively doable for me (maybe 3 tries each). The more you know!

Yep, guess we just had different experiences on this one! Maneater just never gave me a lot of trouble, even in NG+.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:13 am        Reply with quote

TXTSWORD wrote:
I always always found flamelurker to be extremely difficult. A lot of people say he's easy I think? But I have no idea how they think that. I just never figured him out, I guess. I mostly found myself running in terror as he tries to rush me down.

I completely agree with you. All of the other bosses never gave me much trouble, but man Flamelurker took me a good long while. I will say that Flamelurker gets easier the more you fight, since you get used to the patterns. The same is true of Ornstein and Smough in Dark, though that fight becomes very easy if you get another person or Solaire to distract one of them during the first phase.
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Talbain



Joined: 14 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:52 pm        Reply with quote

I played a Mage the first time through and I simply could not get at a distance where I felt safe casting spells (and Soul Arrow was pretty much my default against the boss too). Was always super tense about doing anything other than blocking whenever I fight Flamelurker.
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