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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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 Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 6:36 pm |
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At least Gerstmann managed to be somewhat critical.
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RobotRocker
C-C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER!
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Location: Death Egg Zone
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| Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 6:56 pm |
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| Dracko wrote: |
| At least Gerstmann managed to be somewhat critical. |
Gerstmans review boiled down to "I like this, but I wish there was a bit more variety and content to it".
Herp Derp Sterling is just trying to get Squeenix mad. |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 6:59 pm |
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"plz give me hits"
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ChoAnikiFan1994
tony hawk's pro messageboarding
Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Location: burger fortress
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| Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:01 pm |
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i'm jim sterling the atheist, and i'm better than you
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oh my god immaculate
banned
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:47 pm |
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| 1.0 -- Epic Fail |
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extrabastardformula
millmuck holecutter
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Location: The Nearest Faraway Place
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| Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:31 am |
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| ChoAnikiFan1994 wrote: |
| i'm jim sterling the atheist, and i don't exactly grok the concept of concealment or soft cover |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:20 pm |
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| Quote: |
| When someone dies, or when a character is naked, parts of their body are replaced with large pixels obscuring the details. This is supposed to make things look like video with identifying features removed, I suppose, but ironically the effect is nearly pornographic. If you just showed a breast it would be matter-of-fact, underlining the world these men live in. Blurring them out makes the images feel grotesque. |
The guy intends this as a criticism.
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Takashi
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Mikey
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Location: endless backlog
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:13 am |
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| I'm more concerned about the talk of the game being kind of shit. Loose controls, iffy hit detection? I haven't gotten around to playing the demo but how much merit is there to this? |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:16 am |
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The demo felt suitably frenetic and desperate, considering it's firefights in tight quarters.
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oh my god immaculate
banned
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:39 am |
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| the response just goes to prove that videogame people don't deserve neat things. on the plus side maybe it means I can grab this one for three bucks too. |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:00 am |
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It's kind of impressive just how many seem to miss the point, yes.
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oh my god immaculate
banned
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:14 am |
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| pretty baffling that most of the reviews really harp on the length of the game. I can't remember anyone moaning this much about MW2's 4 hour long SP campaign. |
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St. Michael Biehn
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:58 am |
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| oh my god immaculate wrote: |
| the response just goes to prove that videogame people don't deserve neat things. on the plus side maybe it means I can grab this one for three bucks too. |
If the demo is a good yardstick, this game has precious little in the way of neat things. It's undeniable that there's some genuine and possibly industry-besting inspiration in the audiovisual direction, but all those good ideas are (so far as the demo goes) used to skin an utterly forgettable cover-based shooter with confusing level design and a disconnected sense of gunplay. Forgettable cover based shooters might as well be a synonym for "vanilla" right now.
Nobody ever beefs over length if they come away satisfied. I clocked Halo 3 in about seven hours the first night I had it, for example - you could easily do it in five. Not many people ripped into the game for length.
I haven't played the full game and it's likely I won't - the cost of entry is the difference between a comfortable month and living between paychecks at this point in my life and if I'm going to take a risk on a disc release it'll be that Transformers thing or Crackdown 2.
Which is another entirely valid reason to want more than five hours out of fifty notes, honestly. If you want stylised sleaze there are many excellent films available cheap on DVD. Watch Videodrome or Man Bites Dog and if that doesn't transport you to the icky sleaze experience of your dreams touch your penis a bit. "Unlock" an achievement all over your chest.
I don't really know where I'm going with this post anymore. |
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JoeX111
Joined: 21 Nov 2008
Location: Some City
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:07 am |
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| Dude, did you register today just to post this? |
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oh my god immaculate
banned
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:31 am |
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| St. Michael Biehn wrote: |
| oh my god immaculate wrote: |
| the response just goes to prove that videogame people don't deserve neat things. on the plus side maybe it means I can grab this one for three bucks too. |
If the demo is a good yardstick, this game has precious little in the way of neat things. It's undeniable that there's some genuine and possibly industry-besting inspiration in the audiovisual direction, but all those good ideas are (so far as the demo goes) used to skin an utterly forgettable cover-based shooter with confusing level design and a disconnected sense of gunplay. Forgettable cover based shooters might as well be a synonym for "vanilla" right now.
Nobody ever beefs over length if they come away satisfied. I clocked Halo 3 in about seven hours the first night I had it, for example - you could easily do it in five. Not many people ripped into the game for length.
I haven't played the full game and it's likely I won't - the cost of entry is the difference between a comfortable month and living between paychecks at this point in my life and if I'm going to take a risk on a disc release it'll be that Transformers thing or Crackdown 2.
Which is another entirely valid reason to want more than five hours out of fifty notes, honestly. If you want stylised sleaze there are many excellent films available cheap on DVD. Watch Videodrome or Man Bites Dog and if that doesn't transport you to the icky sleaze experience of your dreams touch your penis a bit. "Unlock" an achievement all over your chest.
I don't really know where I'm going with this post anymore. |
I'm not sure you ever knew where you were going with this post. |
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St. Michael Biehn
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:35 am |
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That complaints about length usually suggest the user was so distanced from the experience as to accurately perceive their investment of time and that this is often symptomatic of hollow, boring games?
No, I think I knew where I was going with that part all along. I just can't understand why I started typing about jerking off to Videodrome as an alternative. |
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evekii
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:03 am |
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| St. Michael Biehn wrote: |
| That complaints about length usually suggest the user was so distanced from the experience as to accurately perceive their investment of time and that this is often symptomatic of hollow, boring games? |
They did not complain about it being to long. |
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St. Michael Biehn
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:32 am |
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| I'm not sure that they would. |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:37 pm |
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Game Journalists Are Incompetent Fuckwits proves yet again it is still essential as ever.
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| Which is not what I’d expected of Square Enix. Sure, you can say that I’m living in the past, with the old 8-bit renditions of Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy. Maybe you say this is gaming of the future, that Square Enix is finally ready to move on from magic and wonder to shooting and brute force to capture my attention. If that’s the truth, then I’m not ready! I can say that this game is unique and certainly has its place among gamers. And I’m never one to turn down a good shooter. But just give me time to adjust, Square; you threw me a curve ball this time! |
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oh my god immaculate
banned
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:19 pm |
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| haha, awesome |
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Toptube
Anti-cabbage Party Candidate
Joined: 23 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 8:55 pm |
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[quote="St. Michael Biehn"]
| oh my god immaculate wrote: |
If the demo is a good yardstick, this game has precious little in the way of neat things. It's undeniable that there's some genuine and possibly industry-besting inspiration in the audiovisual direction, but all those good ideas are (so far as the demo goes) used to skin an utterly forgettable cover-based shooter with confusing level design and a disconnected sense of gunplay. Forgettable cover based shooters might as well be a synonym for "vanilla" right now. |
I cannot comment on the level design as I have (regrettably) not had this game through my hands yet.
But, there are plenty of games out there with "vanilla" gameplay that still offer worthwhile things and I want to defend that for a second. Sometimes said gameplay may even toss in a couple of suprises.
The first Kane and Lynch was a good example of this. I'm still trying to find out why that game got panned so hard. I guess maybe because it ran like shit (on PS3 at least). Yeah, the literal gameplay is basic:
run
gun
take cover
Its pretty distilled. Its not refined, but each part works well enough and there are a couple of neat tweaks to keep the shooting pretty cool.
AND THEN you are doing it through locales that are seriously extremely realistic making the scenarios you play out feel authentic and therefore, fun. Shooting is a very basic gameplay element, but when you are shooting up a bank that may as well be real or an airport rendered in likewise fashion, well hey it adds a level of enjoyment there. Also the graphics are great. accurate, well lit, if not a bit modest. but they perfectly suit each level's design and locale. Just some solid stuff and it takes a lot of subtley to pull it all together like that instead of constantly trying to outdo the last or fill otherwise real places with a bunch of silly art thus making them unreal. The whole level becomes the showpiece.
The other thing that kept me playing Kane and Lynch were those characters. Their story would often unfold in the level so there wasn't a lot of disconnect and it added a frenetic flavor to the whole thing that was pretty cool. You were a couple of too old for this shit criminals doing it all from the hip and one of them specifically, he's a timebomb.
so there is precedence for a game being good despite offering basic and/or vanilla gameplay.
| Quote: |
| Nobody ever beefs over length if they come away satisfied |
well, right.
...?
but its also possible that a game with really good things just wasn't long enough. Like, hey man it would have been nice to play that for 4 more hours. Or maybe some of the gameplay ideas while awesome, were too short lived. "satisfied" is different for each person. Uncharted 2 is one of the most decorated recent games, but there is a whole segment of that game that I would cut. Making it shorter. Its not a long game! Jak 3 has a couple of gameplay ideas that are literally used like 1 or 2 times in the whole game. I wanted to do those things again! and really, the specific things I have in mind weren't even fully realized so they had plenty of room to do it more.
I wager that comments about Kane and Lynch 2 being too short are exactly a reaction to wanting to be in the art direction longer. If its anything like the first game, the sets are amazingly authentic and now that its coated in some effects that cannot be ignored by those who need it to smack their face, I have a feeling some of those effects don't get much of a chance to really be utilized. Again, people feel its too short lived.
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| Transformers thing or Crackdown 2. |
both those games had sucky demos, so i don't think you'd like them either.
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| If you want stylised sleaze there are many excellent films available cheap on DVD. |
yeah but you can't play out that sleaze. |
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geinou
Joined: 07 Apr 2010
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| Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:24 pm |
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| Dracko wrote: |
Game Journalists Are Incompetent Fuckwits proves yet again it is still essential as ever.
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| Which is not what I’d expected of Square Enix. Sure, you can say that I’m living in the past, with the old 8-bit renditions of Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy. Maybe you say this is gaming of the future, that Square Enix is finally ready to move on from magic and wonder to shooting and brute force to capture my attention. If that’s the truth, then I’m not ready! I can say that this game is unique and certainly has its place among gamers. And I’m never one to turn down a good shooter. But just give me time to adjust, Square; you threw me a curve ball this time! |
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I don't know if should just laugh or just cry my eyes out. |
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Ghost Dinosaur
Joined: 05 Feb 2009
Location: Moving
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 4:28 am |
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| Just rented this today (too broke to buy, sorry IO). So far I'm digging it pretty swell, though I've only played the first couple missions. Horizontal split screen! |
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JoeX111
Joined: 21 Nov 2008
Location: Some City
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| Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:43 pm |
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I picked this up the other day and I'm not getting the criticism. It's a strong, tense shooter with some awesome set pieces. They definitely could have done more with Kane and Lynch's interactions, fleshing them out a bit more as characters instead of caricatures, but I've enjoyed it so far.
I wonder if it's receiving a reverse of that Legend of Frank theory: That even a bad Legend of Zelda game will still score well with critics because it's associated with the Zelda franchise. The exact same game, called Legend of Frank, wouldn't score nearly as good, cause it lacks name recognition.
Maybe people associate this too much with the first game, the Jeff Gerstmann shit, and are bashing it accordingly.
Or maybe it's shit and I just like shit. |
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Toptube
Anti-cabbage Party Candidate
Joined: 23 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 9:22 pm |
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| I liked the first shit >_> |
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parker
a wolf adventuring
Joined: 31 May 2007
Location: suplex city
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| Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:51 pm |
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I think it's about equal with the first game. It plays better but it's a bigger waste of these great characters. And once again all the good idea were kept in the media campaign. Can't wait for the trailers for the next game.
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Zigfried
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:44 am |
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Tom Chick's review: http://www.honestgamers.com/reviews/9015/Kane-Lynch-2-Dog-Days.html
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| But what ultimately redeems Kane and Lynch 2 from its own linearity, mediocrity, and narrative neglect is the visual aesthetic. The graphics are shaky – good lord, I nearly threw up numerous times – and the lighting streaks and the screen breaks into pixelated chunks and compression artifacts. |
Full disclosure: I read his review because it's posted at a site I write for, but that's the strangest praise I've ever read. I'm oddly intrigued, but is the presentation actually any good?
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Ghost Dinosaur
Joined: 05 Feb 2009
Location: Moving
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| Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:55 am |
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Zigfried the presentation is awesome. It looks like the game was shot on turn-of-the-century home video. Like a weird over-exposed low-rent Miike movie.
P.S. I think it's way way better than the first one so far, but I mostly didn't like 1 at all except Breakout, which was pretty sweet and made me wonder why the rest of the game wasn't that cool. Only two more missions left, but yeah, I think this is just a case of Games Journalist hiveminds conspiring to knock it down, maybe for not having any secret shit to dawdle around and find. Prolly my GOTY behind Monster Hunter Wii (EDIT: Oh wait, and RDR how could I forget), but admittedly I haven't played much new shit since March. |
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Ghost Dinosaur
Joined: 05 Feb 2009
Location: Moving
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| Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:27 pm |
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| Played about an hour of the multiplayer (Undercover Cop) this morning. Seems pretty cool except for hosts constantly rage-quitting and fucking up the game. |
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 12:14 am |
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This game is a perfect little piece of ultra-violent nihilism.
The ending is brilliant in its economy.
No wonder this got such divided reviews, though. It's an even bigger FUCK YOU than the first game, except even less sentimental and a lot more raw.
That and the fact that it all takes place in a single city, depicted as an urban nightmare, just makes the bodycount feel even more insane.
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Mr. Mechanical
ontological terrorist
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Location: Scare Room 99
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 1:11 pm |
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| Quote: |
Forget Kotaku.
Forget Destructoid.
Forget Tim Rogers.
Forget Jeff Gerstmann.
Forget Giant Bomb.
Forget IGN.
Forget 1UP.
Forget GameSpot.
Forget Eurogamer.
Forget GameSpy.
Forget UGO.
Forget Joystiq.
Forget that Zero Punctuation guy whose name I don’t even know.
Forget Jim Sterling.
Forget all of the hacks because I’m going to elevate meaning and authenticity of gaming criticism to another stratosphere imminently. |
http://twitter.com/bestgamescritic
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 1:33 pm |
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Kane & Lynch 2: Dog Days
a version of Okami that does not suck
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:10 pm |
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parker
a wolf adventuring
Joined: 31 May 2007
Location: suplex city
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| Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:59 pm |
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Took the words right out of my mouth
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Rud31
forum ruler of Iraq
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: SanAnTex
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costel
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Location: Omsk,Florida
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| Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 6:02 am |
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| ghost_dinosaur wrote: |
| Like a weird over-exposed low-rent Miike movie. |
Absolutely nailed it. Especially considering the wild neon bloom, emphasis on foreign agency and scatological weirdness that plagues Miike's early work. That's what a great majority of the game reminded me of, and in the best way possible. I would dare to say that I would enjoy more attempts at emulating that distinctive style, but it would all come off as miserable and boring.
Kane and Lynch 2 is pretty great at the end of the day.
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Dracko
a sapphist fool
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 8:22 pm |
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The funniest thing to come out of the critical backlash against this game was when Yahtzee bitched that visual style was too effective and the anti-heroes too bastardly.
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CubaLibre
the road lawyer
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Location: Balmer
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| Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:33 pm |
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Yahtzee isn't worth listening to even for laughs about how stupid he is.
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Let's Play, starring me. |
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