[Jeff Garneau]

I've been playing around in Shiren DS for a couple of hours and: It's still the same game as the SNES Shiren the Wanderer, plus a few cosmetic changes and slightly tweaked gameplay. There seems to be some kind of cooperative play through Wi-Fi, which is probably the biggest addition to the game. They've also added a tutorial dungeon that you play through the first time you start the game which is probably helpful if you're new to the game and speak Japanese.

Anyways, apparent changes: I don't really remember being able to go back a level when you reach the stairs in the Super Nintendo version, and it might really kill the game as one could use that feature to level up quite a lot (it randomly regenerates the previous floor). On the other hand, grinding levels is possible in the original through a variety of less obvious ways.

The furthest I got was to floor 19, which is just before the last town. The first two new monsters I saw apparently had no special abilities but could do more damage than their contemporaries. The third one was actually a pretty deadly shellfish-type thing that shows up in the mine shaft (along with Kid Tank). It only did one damage per hit until it died, when it makes a 3x3 explosion (knocking out walls) that either reduces you to 1 health or just does 45ish damage outright. I'm not sure which it is. They turn red and stop doing anything when they're in critical condition, though, so it's not too bad. Later on, before the bridge, I ran into some assassin-looking enemy whose only power, it seemed, was to do a lot of damage but not have a lot of HP itself. Finally, there's a new enemy in the marsh which can render your scrolls unusable until you reach the next level of the dungeon.

This game is really filled to the brim, however, with minor tweaks. First off, there are a lot more people just wandering around the dungeon who you can talk to. They seem to have a lot to say, so there are probably new quests to get involved with. The drop rates seem to have been messed with a great deal: I think they might have completely eliminated Medical Herbs, while Heaven and Earth scrolls drop all over the place. Scrolls and wands can be cursed now, but all that seems to do is prevent them from being read/waved (Nodorus can hit them with their curse spell, too). Somehow I walked into a pit trap, but instead of taking me to the next floor it just did 6 damage. Go figure. Items become identified whenever you reach a town. Flame priests seem to do a lot less damage while Kigni Tribes are appearing a lot earlier than I remember and hurting me a lot more. Ghost Mushas appear exactly over the Kimen-Musha corpse, so if you stand on it they won't appear until you move. I think that Minotaurs got swapped out of the first floors they appear in in favor of Ether Devils. I didn't see any of the black crustacean things in the swamp that hit twice. You can now select which of Fei's problems you want to attempt. You get the idea.

I guess all these changes do add up to something, but it's still not really clear if it makes the game too easy. Sure, the minotaurs were kind of cheap and those black crab things did a lot of damage, but you can still lose levels and have your equipment rust in the marsh, and you still get hit hard in Table Mountain. Getting your scrolls cursed can be really bad. Old Man Tank is still Old Man Tank. If you don't like the ability to backtrack, don't. Fei's Final Problem is undoubtedly still almost impossible without abusing copy pots. Is it still Shiren the Impossible? Maybe. If you're that much of a stickler for things, go play Nethack.

On an aesthetic note: much of the animation has been smoothed out. Many monsters seemed to have had frames added, a lot of the effects have been overhauled, and there's a really showy idle animation for when you've been turned into a rice ball. The arrows for the stylus on the touch screen are a lot more intrusive than you'd think. Sorry DAIS, there doesn't seem to be a sound test (though I haven't really tried all the menus as I'm afraid of deleting my file). The music sounds to me just like the SPC set, except maybe a little cleaner.

Forgot to mention: I like it and its save feature is perfect for playing on the go! Are you ready to outwit dangerous monsters and cunning traps to reach the legendary golden condor!? If you still have questions or want to whine about changes, feel free to post in the thread!

[Toups]

This sounds to be something like a remake a la Gunstar Super Heroes. Which I approve of.

Man I really hope this gets brought over stateside... odds aren't great but it seems like all manner of bizarre japanese games are getting released these days that would never have seen the light of day even a few years ago.
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[Broco]

[rye]

[Ktallguy]

I'm getting this game very soon.

I wonder how many people in the US play nethack or other rogue like games?
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--play to win--

[FortNinety]

As someone who knows virtually nothing about Shiren period, can someone pass along a primer?
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[Broco]

[FortNinety]

Oh yeah, I forgot that the game was talked about at one point over at the IC boards.

And Shaper sent this to me over the weekend, in an email he titled "Great Sega Ad", which I though read "Great Sega CD Ad" but it does embody the qualities of an old Sega ad during that era...

http://gameads.gamepressure.com/tv_game_commercial.asp?ID=4954
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[LordGek]

Hey Gang,

Just heard about your forum thread here from dessgeega at Gamer's Quarter.

I know they planned to tone down the difficulty on this one and FEARED it meant losing the whole "character level reset to 1" mechanic which I think is one of the most unique/cool aspects of the COOLER Mysterious Dungeon games. Since this was lost in most of Torneko 3 and Pokemon Mysterious Dungeon (only an option in a few post game dungeons) I sadly figured they'd be doing that here.

I ordered it day 1 anayways (not here yet but could I pick a stupider time of year to order something?) and was STOKED when I learned the level reset deal WAS still in effect...but now you tell me about "up stairs"...ARRRRRGH!

I know I could just NOT ABUSE THIS FEATURE...but I'm afraid the game now will balanced in such a way that ASSUMES everybody is doing it.

My only feeble hopes at this point would be:
1) Fei's Ultimate Dungeon has no up stairs.
2) The upstairs mimics (I saw something to this effect in a screen shot) really tone down the abusability of this feature.
3) The game has new ways to stamp out excessive scumming maybe via some tough out of level dudes suddenly showing up to give you grief.
4) Your end score is somehow effected by abusing/not abusing...like some sort of score multiplier if you NEVER use an upstairs or something like that.

I'd love to hear more about new items or traps, if you've noticed any yet, Jeff.

[Gin]

Man I totally need to fucking play Shiren again.

Tomorrow I will have time too!

[Max Cola]

Wait, so it's a Roguelike where you play a guy with a straw hat and his talking weasel companion?

That's like three good things right off the bat. I need to go play this now.
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Everybody hurts sometimes

[LordGek]

YEAH!

After a long delay (they supposedly sent it out on Dec 16th) I finally got my copy of the game.

Not a whole lot to add so far that Jeff didn't touch on except that for the non Japanese speaking among us you might find this FAQ handy:

http://db.gamefaqs.com/console/snes/file/fuurai_no_shiren.txt
(using Japanese EUC encoding)

This is an English FAQ written for the Japanese Famicon game (obviously before the other folk made the English patch) that does a great job translating all of the objects, characters, creatures, etc. It's not going to cover THIS game 100% since there have been a number of tweaks (I think Fei's puzzles are all new in this one) and additions. That being said it still will give you a HUGE step up on the game.

From Jeff's initial post I was expecting to see two sets of stairs on each level but what they do instead is that when you reach the one stairway or exit from the level you have the choice to take it up or down. I already tested some of its abusability by using the upstairs option to go back to the town level with the first shop only to find, yep, you get a fully re-stocked shop when you re-visit so it will now be easy to simply "re-roll" the shop until it sells the items you're looking for. I can only hope the creatures you meet on the re-visited dungeon levels are at least scaled up a bit according to your current level, but I have yet to be able to concretely prove that.

Oh, and found out the hard way, while you now can do any number of Fei's problems in one sitting...even more in any order as you can chose from all 50 right off the bat, you better remember to store your prizes in between puzzle runs as EVERYTHING you were carrying when you start a puzzle is vaporized. Since it checks off each puzzle as you complete it, I'm assuming you can't get rewarded for completing any puzzle multiple times, so at least that could be a step up from the old days of endless rewards (although I have yet to confirm this).

[LordGek]

I won't let this thread die!

I've finally cleared Table Mountain and opened almost all of the Bonus Dungeons (3 more ontop of the original 3 of the SNES game).

Table Mountain has been made easier in countless little sublte ways, and even the two initial bonus dungeons by allowing you to bring in buddies and keep the few levels you gained on the way to them from the first few levels of Table Mountain (as they, like the original, are in the second and third villages), are lot easier...but Fei's Final Problem is still hardcore fun!

All three of the NEW bonus dungeons are essentially extensions of the main Table Mountain and allow you to bring in any and all equipment and buddies. They're all pretty extreme with limited items and lots of level 3 and 4 guys with different themes.